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" I surrendered a daughter in 1966 and have been involved with 26 adoption newsgroups for 17 yrs. In that time I have learned that birthparents want original birth certificates restored and available to their adult children and I feel it is their right to have them. "

" BN's point is that it had nothing to do with reunion - good or bad. It is a RIGHT. A right that all other people take for granted. Even felons are not denied the right to their own name!

If it is not a right, Megan, who is it always presented as a balancing of adoptees rights against the alleged "rights" of their mothers to privacy?

What other laws are written in order to protect lies and secrets?

Do we not peruse men t prove paternity, even when it might embarrass them or ruin their careers? Why should we make special laws to protect mothers from maternity? That too is inequality.

"

" Megan,

Thanks for clarifying. That was not clear in your original letter. I apologize for my judgmental remarks.

I don't know what the technical qualification for a "civil right" is, but I do know this: I was pressured to lwt my daughter be adopted in order to provide her with a "better life." However, like adoptees in 46 states she is deneied the same right as non-adopted citizens to access to her own original birth certificate. Why? Why should she or any adopted person be discriminated against and treated lesser? That does not fulfill the promise made to me and other mothers in order to get us to sign over our children. Being denied EQUAL ACCESS to one's own birth records is discriminatory and is not "better."
"

" We were so brainwashed into believing that we were so unfit, so unworthy, so terrible a person that we could not even raise our own children that our legacy has become a generation of millions of women who have lived with little self-esteem. They are not going to be the ones who register, still believing they are the "good girl gone bad" as one mother told her adoptee daughter, who is my friend. "

" Megan wrote: God has a plan for families. Children should be nurtured in loving homes by a father and a mother who are also husband and wife. ``Redefining kinship,'' as advocated by the some of these groups, is a dangerous thing.

Adoption redefines kinship. My daughter was taken from me BECAUSE I was single and for no other reason. God has no "plan" for families, or SHE would not allow unmarrieds to become pregnant at all! If the Goddess believes that I would not have nurtured my daughter, then SHE doesn't know me at all.
Using registries has been shown to be a complete failure. MOST of the mothers of adoption loss are from the BSE (baby scoop era) from the end of WWII to 1973 when Roe v. Wade was passed. MOST of the children who were sold into adoption by the unscrupulous adoption agencies are now coming into their maturity. Many of those mothers are in their 60's and 70's now, and do not even realize that registries exist, let alone that they are now ALLOWED to use them. "

" Megan's "Clarification". You seem to be hung up on "rights" and "identity". Megan, you have your identity and you-in whatever way you approached it, have your rights by searching for your answers. So don't even go to the argument about other's rights,etc. As an older person, I would like to knoe my medical history if nothing else. I have had a lot of medical issues in the last few years, and would like to know what I and my children and their children are in for. Until you have children, and they begin to ask quesions about their histories then maybe you will understand. "

" Lisae0263:

Mutual consent registries are a wonderful idea in theory - but they have a very poor record in reality. Most match about 5% - that's TOTAL, over 20 years time. Some have said they don't match more because the first parents don't want to be found - but I know too many first parents who very much wanted to find or be found and did not know about any registry. It is also possible that an adoptee wants information, but is not interested in reunion. Another problem is that the first parent(s) might be deceased. Illinois needs to follow Oregon, New Hampshire, Alabama and other states - allow all adults access to their original birth certificates, period. Anything short of that leads to 77 pages of legalese and the concept that all adoptees are equal but some adoptees are more equal than other adoptees. "

" Megan wrote: ``Redefining kinship,'' as advocated by the some of these groups, is a dangerous thing.


Megan, "redefining kinship" is exactly what adoption does in the first place.



"

" If Pinto Bean feels that I'm twisted, then I wonder what she/he might be but I'm not going to stoop to their level and do name calling. I have NOT spoken for all adoptees. Since I have been an adoption reform movement advocate for over 30 years, was the founder of a search and support group, and still help some with their searches although I'm not as active as I once was, I have communicated with many triad members. I have never kept track of the exact number I've communicated with or how many I helped to reunite. I'm not one of those who lie and say that they have a 100% success rate plus I helped people and encouraged them to do alot of the searching on their own. But I have indeed communicated with more triad members than many. If you don't like the forum that I started, than don't read it. AMEN!

"

" As an adoptee myself, I feel that there should be a registry through the state where one can go to obtain information regarding their biological parents, as well as biological parents obtain information regarding the children surrendered for adoption. It should, however, be consensual. I too have located my birthmother and even though I have my "gold" certificate (this is the birth certificate with adopted parents names), it would be nice to have the original birth certificate along with my hospital bracelet that was given to me by my birthmother. "

" PintoBean:

The point is - if you don't want your birth certificate and/or don't want to search, that is YOUR perogative. BUT - don't tell anyone else what they should or shouldn't do. I know many adoptees who are not interested. That's fine with me. But their reasons are not my reasons. "

" Clarification. I don't oppose the current Illinois bill. I support reunions when both parties want them. Some groups, such as Bastard Nation, oppose HB4623 bill in favor of "unconditional access.” The group’s members have called HB4623 a "dangerous bill that must be voted down." (Quoting from an e-mail that was forwarded to me). They favor a hypothetical bill that would give no chance for anyone to file an affidavit for anonymity. Bastard Nation claim that adopted persons obtaining Original Birth Certificates is an issue of “identity” and “rights,” not search-and-reunion. They whine a line about how adoptees are the last group in America to gain full civil rights. Melodrama. I don't believe that OBC is a civil rights issue. I don't want Bastard Nation speaking for me. The birth certificate I use for identification contains the names of my real parents-the ones who adopted, loved and cared for me. "

" To "rightsofadoptees"
I see your "agenda" as we all did in the forum of the pantagraph. I applaud Megan for speaking HER mind. How dare you speak for all adopted children.."very few adoptees in the state of Illinois feel this way"...how do you know that? How dare you speak for us! You know nothing except how to twist things for your own agenda. I suggest those reading this look at the forum section of the pantagraph and read how twisted...Rightsofadoptees actually is! "

" I think it's really ridiculous to create a false birth certificate just because someone is adopted. If there's one thing I learned from watching soap operas since the age of 12. Don't lie to your kids - sooner or later the secret will come out. The child should be told the truth appropriate the his or her age and the questions that he or she asks. It should be done in the most positive way possible, but lies are not the answer. There should be no feelings of shame about one's history. "

" Megans comment lacks any substance or reason. Simplified, she found her family and the rest of us dont have the right to find ours. Then she justifies her position with "God has a plan." We are to conclude from then she knows gods plan so dont argue with her. This kind of thinking is narcisisstic, primitive, and childlike. Clearly she doesnt know God's plan and arguments based on morals, values, and clear thinking are needed to explore a topic of this importance. There is no right to secrecy in adoption the Oregon Court of Appeals already ruled on that. The need to know ones natural history, and genetic origins is a well established principle in psychology and the UN recognises this a human right. When people claim to know Gods plan and substitute that for thought it often cloaks the lack of an internal moral compass.
Pathwaysinadoptions.com "

" What about for health reasons? Some things like diabetes, certain types of cancer, etc. are hereditary. Shouldn't the adoptee have the right to know who their birth parent(s) are so they can know past family medical history? They may still be asked not to contact the birth mother (if that's her choice), but they could maybe have a go-between, like a lawyer or doctor, contact the mother to find out the family history & any medical problems or disease the child may have inherited. I believe there is possibly a way to block unwanted contact without blocking what may possibly be important, vital knowledge about a person's health. "

" Number one point: I believe you HAVE to have a birth cert when you die in order to be legally dead-if you weren't born, you couldn't be dead. This happened when my father died. Number two point: we adopted a baby in 1973 through an agency and at the final adoption in the courtroom, the judge told us that the baby's records would be permanently sealed, BUT if when he was 18 or 21(forgot which), he COULD see his records and find out who his biological parents are. No one else could look at them, but he can. "

" My husband and I were lucky in this situation. We took in a foster child and got her history including obc. Then when we adopped her we got her new birth certificate so when she is old enough she will have both.

"

" "...regardless of the wishes of birth mothers..." indeed. I guess Megan doesn't believe the surveys and agency statistics that 80-90% of first parents welcome contact from the sons and daughters they relinquished. Much like her mother welcomed her. Some were even promised that their children would have FULL ACCESS to records upon turning 18. Some first parents placed or tried to place contact information in the files, information which was never made available to their children when requested.

Anonymity was a promise to the adoptive parents. Records do not seal upon relinquishment or even termination of parental rights - they seal upon ADOPTION, even stepparent adoption. Even a mutually satisfying reunion won't unseal them.

What Illinois really needs is a clean bill - no disclosure vetoes. A clean bill can be written in a few paragraphs. The current bill requires 77 PAGES with all its twists and turns!

To assume that an adult adoptee, facing a "no contact" request, would automatically violate that request is to assume that adult adoptees, as a class, cannot be trusted. That sounds like discrimination.
"

" I can't believe that Megan is so calous to think that having ones own birth certificate is not a civil right. If anything, she does not have the right to say what I can or can not have. She is just about as bad as the ones in State governments denying a persons original birth certificate. THAT IS, the right of a person to have that document. It belongs to them, no one else!! "

" Megan,

Perhaps you were overwhelmed by some organizations who asked fro your support. If it's not your thing to be an activist and help others, fine. But why take the time and trouble to come out AGAINST allowing other people the same good fortune you and your mother have found?

You speak of God's plan. Do you really believe God intends for mothers who are unable to care for their infants to suffer the lifelong agony of never knowing - and the same for the innocent babes? IF so, why then do ALL of the biblical adoption stories (Moses, Esther, etc.) involve being reunited???

It is adoption that REDEFINES KINSHIP, Megan, not nature! Laws legalize lies by issuing falsified "amended" birth certificates as if you were born to your adopters.

God's plan is perfectly natural. It is human intervention that screws it up. The desire to have a baby when God - or one’s own actions - has deemed some people unable to creates a demand which in turn creates a $6.3 billion dollar corrupt worldwide industry trafficking babies like so much commodity to fill that demand.


"

" Your hypocrisy SELFISHNESS and MEANNESS are astounding. Like a freed slave voting against abolition of slavery!! A man on death row being freed by DNA and voting to keep the death penalty!

The laws that prevent such normal, natural relationships are man made, not God's. Do you advocate others BREAK THOSE laws as you obviously did to find one another? Is that a preferable solution: to make law-breakers of normal citizens with a normal desire and a CIVIL RIGHT to be allowed the SAME access as every other non-adopted citizen to a records that pertains to them?

I hope that God acts to soften your mean-spirited and selfish heart, Megan.
"

" Are the original birth certificates even available? Once there is a new one I would think the old one would be destroyed. It would be odd to have more than one birth certificate showing different details. Other wise what is the purpose of the new birth certificate. It should be called something else if both are valid or available. "

" This is stunning!

It is not uncommon for persons wishing to find the truth of their origins to turn to adoptee rights organizations for assistance in finding their birth relatives. Nor is it odd that, once they have found, find they have no more interest in the cause.

But for someone who has found the truth of their past and then decide that others do not have a similar right is amost unbelievable. Many adoptees are NOT seeking reunion, just the truth. For them search is not a suitable substitute for what they seek but it is the only route open to them. It is time consuming and often expensive. In fact, post adoption services provided by state or state-mandated providers is a lucrative source of continuing income for these entities.

Americans generally hold that individuals are entitled to copies of any official documents or records that pertain to themselves. Our OBC is the foremost among those records we have a right to. "

" "At first, the political arguments made a lot of sense to me. However, after much careful study, pondering and prayer, I have decided for myself that I cannot embrace these groups' basic philosophy regarding family."

This is why we have a separation of church and state.

Prayer does not belong in politics. "

" Your hypocrisy is dazzling! It's like getting a heart transplant and then, after divine revelation, deciding God never intended for body parts to be recycled.

You need to revisit your Bible and re-read the story of Moses, the first adoptee. Not only was he given over from a married mother to a single mother (the Pharoah's daughter), but God provided that Moses' birth mother was enlisted to care for him. What if Moses' 'birth certificate' had been locked away in an Egyptian courthouse and he had not been able to know his heritage and save his people?

When a birth mother signs a relinquishment document, she gives up ALL rights. What becomes of documents pertaining to her child from that day forward is totally out of her control. If for any reason her child should be difficult to place and remains in long-term foster care, his/her active birth certificate will be the one which contains his/her birth mother's identifying information on it. If the adoption should be annulled, the amended certificate will be locked up and the original one with her name on it reinstated. The birth mother has no control whatsoever over these matters.

"

" I am just stunned with your statement that "to obtain one's original birth certificate is not a civil or human right". You did not say how you felt when you requested your OBC and was denied. I can't imagine that you leaped with joy. I find it so hard to believe that a reunited adoptee would not care that that they did not have their OBC. Then to oppose legislation that would allow adoptees to request their OBC and not be denied is so hard for me to believe. Believe me you have to be one of the very few adoptees in the State of Illinois who feel this way. Organizations have formed to fight for adoption reform because of so many believing in fighting for their human/civil right. There are legislators who feel these adoptees are correct in fighting for adoption reform. Unfortunately, there seem to be some legislators yet who still want to protect the privacy of the birth parents and uphold the confidentialty factor. The truth is that the majority of birthparents were not promised confidentialty and want to hear from their offspring.
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